Wednesday, March 03, 2010

Argentina vs. Germany - Dave P. Player Ratings

Great victory are my ratings:

Great team victory tonight for Argentina. Happy to get a little revenge over Germany even-though the match means pretty much nothing, but good to beat a top national team. This game was very interesting, it was good to see Veron play alongside Messi and Higuain, and the defense consisting of 4 CB's worked out extremely well. In the first half we kept possession very well, unlike any game I have seen from us in a long tine. We were moving it well between our defenders and midfielders with confidence, and whenever we lost the ball our defense was 100% organized and solid. In terms of offense we did not have much, as always Di Maria was our main attacking spark, who set up our only gol from Higuain.

In the second half it was more of the same we were content with possession, especially with the lead. Veron never ventured too far forward to get involved in the attack so whenever Higuain or Messi had the ball they had about 4 Germans surrounding them and not teammates to pass too, which was frustrating. But the main take away from this game is that our defense played excellent, and we kept possession with confidence completely shutting down any chances the Germans had. Overall a very good victory and some key defensive performances that give me more confidence in our back line as we get close to SA. Here are the ratings.....

Romero 7: Great game versus a top oppoenet today for our starting GK. Early on did not have much to deal with but he was always quick off his line to the ball. In the 8th min had bad communication with Heinze who headed it backwards but was quick to react. Just like when Otamendi passed it back to him he was very fast to sprint of his line and beat Podolski to the ball. Very confident in the air with every ball into the box and very safe hands in the air. Our defensive line was very solid and Romero only had to save 2 or 3 shots, but was there every time. Great positioning on set pieces and great clean sheet.

Otamendi 7: In the beginning of this game everyone was questioing how Otamendi would do, and he played very well. He setteled in the game quickly and was never found out of position. He worked hard to get forward a few times and hustle back to his postion. Had 2 or 3 last second tackles to stop counter attacks by the Germans. Made one sloppy move in the back which Samuel cleaned up getting a Yellow card. But Otamendi has proven he deserves a spot on the NT and in South Africa. A Very composed performance by the youngster.

Demichelis 7.5: Excellent performance by the heart of our central defense. Demi was everywhere with his typical no nonsense tackles and brick wall mentality. He came out in the first half full of energy which set the tone for our defense the rest of our game. Demi saved Heinze from a sloppy miss up in the back, and was smart in getting a yellow card or else Germany would have had a 1 on 1. Whenever there was a counter Demi was their to stop the ball or slow down the attack to get more players back behind the ball. Unfortunate to get injuried with a BALLACK knee to the eye, hopefully he will be ok. Looking forward to more gritty performances by Demi.

Burdisso (sub in 56 min or Demichelis) 7: Subbed in for Demichelis’ injury, and slotted in perfectly. Was in perfect position playing alongside Samuel and carried on playing like Demi. Great timed tackles, and there was a time when he got beat but sprinted back only to win the ball back and clear it out of danger. Burdisso is getting better and with his time at ROMA has proven he is a solid defensive player. Unlucky not to get a touch on Veron’s ball in the last 5 mins to score.

Samuel 7: Welcome back to the NT Walter. Like the rest of our defense a very solid performance from the Wall. Had many good one on one tackles on Klose and Podoloski, organized the back line well and never caught out of postion, a very obedianet defensive display. He understands how to use his body perfectly to maneuver attackers off the ball. In the second half was more quiet but went about his job very effeicently made no mistakes.

Heinze 6: Not much to say about Heinze for this game, had a few good tackles but with the Germans not really attacking down the wings he did not have much to do defensively. He did attempt to get forward a few times but nothing came out of it. Made one mistake that could have costed us but Demichelis was their to save him. Good game by Heinze overall. Was injuried in the 47th min. Hopefully it is nothing serious, but I know many of you guys hope it is = (.

Clemente (sub in 47 min for Heinze) 5.5: Came in for Heinze once he was injuried. Pushed forward immediately and showcased his fast pace. He looked to play with his teammate Veron and did this well, however, he was caught out of postion 3 times I counted. There were a few crosses when he let his player get in behind him. Decent performance but I feel Heinze was more confident at LB.

Jonas 8: Wow what can I say, everytime he puts on the Argentina colors he transforms into a work horse. In the beginning of the game he pushed forward to look for Messi and Higuain however, we were lacking in attack creativity as usual. Like always he got back in defense and helped out Otamendi. As the game moved into the second half he was everywhere. He stopped atleast 10 German attacks, winning the ball from Lahm and other midfielders. Jonas is a solid workhorse and deserves his spot on the NT with the "never stop working" attitude he has. One of the best tracking back performances I have seen by a outside midfielder. Absolute beast.

Mascherano 7: The captain has be out of form in his past couple NT performances, however, I am glad to say that he is back to his bulldog ways after watching him tonight. Masche hustled all night shutting down the German attack as well as Ballack. He is another one of the main reasons why our defense was so organized tonight. He did nothing in the attack end of things, however he really made the Germans look terrible in their own attack by busting up passes and tackling balls away which is what he was put on the field to do, solid performance.

Verón 6.5: Played great alongside Mascherano and was always looking for an intricate pass up front but never really played any dangerous attacking balls. He did combine well a few times with Di Maria and Messi, however, there were many times when he would force the ball to a spot on the pitch which would cause a 50/50 battle. In the second half he slowed down completely with pushing forward and was content with holding possession which he did very well. Good match by Veron but would have liked to see more movement and combination with our
attacking players. Maybe sub in Pastore for him because he was getting very tired after 70 mins.

Di María 7.5: Angél is an attacking gem. He was always looking to push forward but never recklessly. He has immense pace and showed it well against the Germans tonight, he beat many of them with touches of magic and would look to combine with Messi and Higuain. There was a moment when Higuain played him in but was offside and missed his opportunity. Then there was his other opportunity where he beat two germans on the top of the box to have his open shot get touched by Adler and deflect off the crossbar. Great attacking presence, and got his assist with a beautiful over the top counter attacking ball that set Higuain in to score. In the second half we were possessing more so he did not see as much action but still Di Maria is full of tricks and attacking prowess. There were times where he looked like the Barcelona Messi that we see week in and week out, great game.

Higuaín 5.5: What can I say, he always seems to find the back of the net when you think that he is having a bad game. In the first half he probably touched the ball only 4 or 5 times, but one was a good ball to Di Maria, and another consisted of a very eloquent move around the German keeper to a precise finish. Higuain looked to combine well with Di maria, but not really well with Messi. There was a time when he was pushing forward and Messi was to his left, but he took it himself and got stuffed. As the game went on you could see that he was getting frustrated. He has all the smarts to be a brilliant striker, and great body awareness but was not getting supplied the ball. Great game winner by El Pipita and looking forward to seeing him shine in South Africa.

Tevez (sub in 62 min for Higuain) N/A: Subbed in with about 30 mins to showcase himself but did nothing. He was running hard everywhere, but when you don't get any balls played to you and your striking partner (Messi) is frustrated and tired then nothing really happens. Good to see him run hard for 30 mins though.

Messi 5: Pretty quiet night for Messi on the NT is beginning to sound like a broken record, but it is true. Messi played ok tonight, with all his talent he always makes 3 or 4 mesmerizing runs where he beats
3 or 4 players. But all these runs ended in being fouled or not having anyone to lay the ball of too. There was one great little combination between Messi, Higuain, and Di Maria which lacked a finishing touch but when it happened it looked amazing. Messi all game was checking back behind the half line to receive the ball, like past games he has no one to combine with other than Veron, but he is playing to deep to
get involved with the attack. Waiting for that one game where Messi will shine and score 1 or 2 goles. Overall a frustating performance from Messi.


Alex Camacho said...

Why not try Pastore or Milito? Ridiculous.

Maxi Lopez said...


Anonymous said...

Micho may need surgery on his cheekbone, not good news at all. Not sure how long it would take him to recover, I am not sure that long and he will wear a cover, but my worry will be if he gets game time at BM now after his surgery.


Dave P said...

Maxi Lopez...please explain

johnny said...

Thanks, as always, for the ratings Dave. I would agree that the most heartening thing about this match was the teamwork displayed on defense. But offensively ? When will the nightmare end ? And, even more scary, does Maradona want it to end ?! Are we looking at a gameplan and philosophy that involves slowing the game down except for a few counterattacks here and there ? Winning 1-0 (like Uruguay again) and feeling good about it until, inevitably, it doesn't work out. Honest to God, I don't understand how it can be so difficult to put our very talented players up front on better, more effective, display. I won't argue with Seba that Veron is playing his best futbol ever, but am I off base to think Aimar or Banega would be more effective in penetrating and dishing ! (My basketball lingo dies hard:).

ZiggY said...

Looks like Demichelis' injury is serious and needs surgery (to the cheek bone)... this means he'll be on the sidelines for quite some time. I hope it wont risk his World Cup chances... we need him!

Victor said...

Somebody has a little stick up their asses. wow. Saying di maria had a 7.5 is dumb. messi 5.5? i mean it was hard to find him but when he was found he did try like messi does. He didnt do anything wrong really we just didnt get possession enough to give him the chances he usually gets.
Higuain didnt get much chances we only took few shots at goal but he made one important and clear one count. He didnt suck. Doesnt deserve 5.5
Clemente 5.5????? seriously he wasnt mr PERFECT but he didnt play bad. He was a great sub compared to what we could of had.
Good Game by heinze honestly. not bad compared to other of his games.
Why does our goalkeeper get a 7?? not his fault he didnt get tried out in the game. but little to no times he was perfect.

My Ratings:
Romero 9
Otamendi 7.5
Demichelis 8
Burdiso 8
Samuel 7
Heinze 7.5
Clemente 7
Jonas 8
Mascherano 8.5
Di Maria - 9 (created everything)
Higuain - 7.5
Tevez - N/A (truely didnt do anything)
Messi - 8 (when he did have the chance)

Anonymous said...

Micho is out 5 weeks, which is not bad.

Anonymous said...

And will not miss the world cup.

Sebastian said...

Agree or disagree, all I'll ask you is to keep it polite and to not say things like: "These ratings are pathetic" or "saying this or that is dumb".

Please, come up with your own ratings. Agree or disagree with Dave. But don't be offensive and don't slam Dave like this because it's not the right thing to do.

Let's discuss every grade he gave every player, but lets do it in a civilized way. That's all I'm asking.


Dave P said...

Victor I never said anything bad about Messi and never questioned the fact that he was not trying hard. But if you read what I wrote for his rating you will understand that he did not impact the game that much, and impacting the game is what he is put on the pitch to do. I feel that a 5 is good for him. I also say that he had to come back to get the ball almost every time, this means the midfield was not supplying him with balls to get more involved, which is exactly what you said when criticizing me.

In regards to your other ratings, they are actually very similar to mine...I do not give out many 8's or even 9's unless someone played absolutely spot on amazing and dominated their task. It's all a sense of opinion. Di Maria got a 7.5, the second highest rating, that means he played excellent. My ratings are more about a write up on each player rather then just looking at a number.

Anonymous said...

what does veron do?
we need a play maker not someone to hold the ball/break up play thats mash job.
we badly need either benega or aimar not veron to supplie those killer passes.

Anonymous said...

I agree with Johny, defense we were great but offensively not, we need creative midfield(Banega&Pastore)link between midfield to offense need to work on, so messi an higuain can work their magic..vamos argentina.

Sam said...

Thanks Dave for the detailed ratings. Not everyone will agree with ratings in general because each person has their own criteria when it comes to rating players such as involvement and contribution of a player in the game, scoring goals and making the least mistakes possible etc...But the detailed analysis of each player is more important to me than the scores so thanks for that.

I haven't seen our team that organized and solid defensively in a long time. Also in attack, the team looked threatening, dominant in midfield and played as a team. I enjoyed watching them hold possession in the last few minutes of the game.

As I pointed out in my previous post, Gutierrez is a very important player for us and he showed that in the game, he was unbelievable!! He cut out a lot of the German attacks even in crucial moments.

Also I said before that I wanted to see Messi pick the ball in midfield and make those runs to open up the opposition defense. I was glad that it happened on a few occasions and when it happened he was able to penetrate the German defense. Messi and Veron had a better game than the ones that they played in the qualifiers. DiMaria, as always played well and I expect him to be our star at the WC. Romero looked confident in goal and he is definitely our number 1.

Higuain did not necessarily play badly but there was lack of supply to him from midfield and couldn't get involved much. But the good news is, when he is presented with a chance, he scores which is important.

Even though friendlies don't mean much, but this one means alot because it will give the team the confidence in needs heading into the world cup.

Anonymous said...

great to see the defense problem solved. still need a better midfield. move jonas back to RB and put in aimar+banega for veron and we have a good chance in south africa.

hope demi isnt hurt too bad :/

Anonymous said...


Alex Camacho said...

I was not that impressed with Messi or Veron. The reality is that since Riquelme left, we do not have a tried and tested AM. Which is why I'd have liked to see Pastore and Aimar get a chance to show they can do it (Banega is a deep lying midfielder, not an enganche/10). I hoped Messi could have done it, but it seems that is not his forte, and certainly not what he does for Barca. I don't think Veron is the answer, but it's not like we have an obvious choice. I guess Diego has decided to go with the old-but-tested over a fresher-but-untested. Why in a friendly I can only think because he wanted to win (and take some of the pressure off) more than he wanted to learn for the WC. Too bad.

Anonymous said...

Jonaz could put on right back to take otamendi place, no otamendi please he was useless same as palermo losing ball so often no skill.

Anonymous said...

jonas/zenetti demi samual heinze

messi mash banega/aimar de maria

hig d.milito

bench: milito,cambassio,garay, tevez, usteri,either jon/zen and ban/aim
to me this is a very balanced team with good cover for all positions

Anonymous said...

opps add pastore to the bench

msi2 said...

Forget Messi muchachos, Di Maria is going to be our true star.

salvio supporter said...

Couldn't watch the game, but I'm very glad everyone is impressed by Di María. He truly is one of our best players, and never disappoints me. Every time I saw him playing for Argentina, from the U-20 to today, has been my favourite on the field.

Also very happy for Higuaín, who may not be the match player, but it's always there giving your team a goal. That's his job, and for Argentina, he's doing it perfectly well. I see many ask for Banega or Aimar -- Pablito worked quite well with el Pipita against Peru. And is a must-have after all. This should have been Banega's and Milito's opportunity, and what's left now? Israel? Not the best team to test any player.

And, thank god for Samuel. Funny that we're now desperate about the attack, and not so much about the defense (not that we didn't care anyway). I thought this was gonna take a loooong time to happen, but, well. Great to see advances; I hope, Bilardo-related advances. Sadly, the player we're all expecting to explode -Messi- is always the most violently treated, and in the WC it's gonna be much worse. I think it's time for Maradona to start considering a replacement for him, "just in case". They don't let him play much right now, either, and I don't think it would be an insult to his talent to have him on the bench. But it's getting necessary to conceive a Messi-less team, since we're playing with almost ten players. If Maradona can't find good tactics (which he probably won't), Messi is just making things worse. I repeat that I didn't watch the game, and Messi may have been just OK (or even better), but if everybody says he can't play freely, we need something else.

About the chat, I didn't even have time to say 'hello', but it's nice, really. The only thing is that the polls and other information flashing right below the chat goes too fast. Yeah, what a complaint! Must be my computer. But great chat!

chengue said...

i am happy for the does wonders for team morale. on paper these guys are unstoppable.

the only issue is the lack of a number 10. pastore is too green and i agree banega is that sort of blog. aimar needs to be given a chance. he is at a good age and the only one that is street wise enough to do the job.

Mohd said...

Why is all the hype about Veron playing good? he did not. he is slow, cannot shoot anymore and defenitely cannot run and dribble. we have a very non-creative midfield. for the million time Benaga should get the spot. But sadly (yes sadly) with Arg winning the ignorant fat-boy will now be convinced that he is one hell of a coach and will stick to his formation!

on the other hand, why not try Pastore in the second half. he is the closest thing that we had related to a creative midfielder...and Messi, well i adore him. he is a genius. but if the lousy coach we have is not making use of him then maybe its time we try something else. There is absolutely nothing wrong with starting Messi on the bench!

Rune said...

As usual I think Dave's ratings are a bit too high for most players. It's true that we are argie supporters and that we love our players, but in my opinion this was not a very good performance at all by our team. Defence looked more solid than before, that's true....but other than that nothing has changed from the other games under Diego. No game plan, no tactics offensively. No player to link between midfield and attack. Messi dropped deep, far too deep at times, and that means we're playing with a lone striker. For Argentina with all the talents we have in attack to play with one lonely striker is in my opinion PATHETIC!

My ratings:( feel free to tell me what you think and if some of you agree)

Romero: 6.5
Otamendi: 5.5
Demi: 7
Samuel: 7
Heinze: 6
Jonas: 7.5
Veron: 6
Masch: 6
Di Maria: 6.5
Messi: 5
Higuain: 5.5
Burdisso: 6

Rune said...

Forgot Clemente, I would give him 5,5

Rune said...

Forgot Clemente, I would give him 5.5

Joe said...

I really do not know where to start. Before the game started I told my friend (a brazilian fan), that argintina has been playing sow bad that it really can only get better. If I had to choose i would have been more worried if we had a bad defensive game last night than an offensive like we had. Argentina won against a potentially gold medalist at there backyard and we deserved to win. That gives me some confidence for the WC. Maradona always said give time to implement my ideas and we will be succesful.

Maradona is going to have alot of days with the team before our first game. Let us keep our defence solid and up our offensive by 40-50% and i belive we will be powerful.

Ill say it once more we won against a team that have the possibility to win the cup. We one in there backyard and we deserved to win.

LaTiNo said...

Some guys are never happy. For the first time in many, many matches we had a team that was solid defensively and won from a topteam like Germany IN Germany, and still we are whining that we don't have a team that plays as Barcelona. Well guys, wake up. In real life a team needs time to play like Barcelona.
A team is built up from the back. As long as you don't concede goals and occasionally score from a counterattack I'm happy. As long as you win the cup!
When the team goes to SA they will have a month time to get tuned in better and get a more fluent style of play.

That said, I think it's a shame Aimar didn't get a chance to play the second half. I believe Veron is a key player, and defensively he's good too, but the team needs a replacement if he's injured, out of form or just tired at the end of the game.
And Aimar (or one of my other favorites Banega) could be the replacement. Aimar is a little better experienced though.

The defense played well, but I want to see them play against fast and skilled (wing)players like Robben, Kaka, CR etc

Higuain proved he's a lethal and effective killer and Di Maria has stolen my hart a long time ago already! He will be the star of this WC!!

Messi, ah well....he will need to have a lucky day, perform well, and maybe then he will finally break his chains....but if he doesn't....just dare to replace or even bench him....
Maybe next WC he might be the star he should be.

All in all, I was happy with the performance of this team. Attack could be better, and will be better, as long as the defense keeps this level...

LaTiNo said...

btw, I'm already dreaming of a superteam in 2014:


Keeper: Romero, who will be a worldclass and experienced keeper (playing for Barcelona) in 2014!

Back: Otamendi, Demichelis or Samuel as the Experienced Rock, Garay


Emperor Mascherano and a renewed Gago as defensive midfielder, Di Maria still electrifying and more experienced on the left, Messi on the right

Banega, who then will play a more attacking game and becomes the new Riquelme just behind the strikers, lethal with his ballcontrol and passing

Attack: worldclass striker Higuain paired with Aguero, at his prime too in 2014

Whatya think?

Anonymous said...

i hate these germans!

i hate these germans!

i hate these germans!

why everytime argentina plays germany argentine players get injured?

wc90: Ruggeri and Burruchaga

wc06: Abbondanzieri

and now: Demichelis and Heinze

never a german player gets injured! not only against argentina, i really can't remember a game a german player was substituted because of injury.

i really hate these germany

Vitalij from guess what: germany!

Anonymous said...

by the way: germany had only one shot on arggentinas goal in the first half.

the germany commentatory said the last this happened was in the last millenium! so argentina's defended really well, and this is more important than to attack well.

Vitalij from germany

GK said...

Good player ratings again Dave P, always an interesting read. My only real disagreement would be with your rating of Romero. I think he deserves better than a 7, even if you don't normally give out 8 or 9 ratings. He was flawless in my opinion. I can't get over how fast he runs off his line and grabs crosses from mid air with ease. I truly believe he can be a difference maker for Argentina in the World Cup. The only thing I noticed that he did wrong was that he didnt (appear to) call for the ball when Samuel cleared which resulted in Higuian's goal anyways.

The two best players on the field in my opinion would easily be Jonas and Di Maria. I cannot wait to see Di Maria play over the next few years, he will definatly become a world class player, if some don't consider him there already.

And finally Otamendi. I would be the first person here on Mundo to critisize Maradona for his inclusion in the starting 11 but he really seemed to prove himself last night. I was skeptical especially because he was in the RB role instead of CB but he played really well. He attacked and thats what we need on the national team, an attacking wing back. We all know we can kiss Zanetti good bye but is it safe to say Otamendi is his replacement or am I jumping the gun?


Michael said...

I'd like to see Otamendi and Heinze replaced. Otamendi never really made any attacking runs and shouldn't be playing full back in the first place!

The remaining friendlies, we should try out Pastore as the enganche and replace Otamendi with a natural fullback, like Zabaleta or Zanetti.

GK said...

I agree, I would much rather see a natural wing back in place of Otamendi. Someone like Zabaleta, Zanetti or Insua but the fact is Diego won't call up any of those three for whatever reason. I was pleased with how Otamendi played yesterday and if Diego won't use a natural RB or LB, Otamendi could fill that position.... assumming he can play as well as he did last night in every game for the ALbiceleste.

Benji said...

It seems like no-one connects with Messi. The midfield is not connecting with the offense like they do with defense. Higuain seems to avoid Messi as if he played for a rival team. I think the defensive play is a good idea because that clean sheet is important. Still...we have to have a '3rd man release' when we have possession so Messi can have options. And yes, he will get fouled 3 times out of 4 because that is almost the only way to stop him.

Anonymous said...

I totally agree with michel, we need to replaced otamendi, never call him again. we need zanetti and zabaleta instead a pure right full back, and pastore and banega is our solution in midfield.

Joe said...

I believe the big advantage of playing otamendi is we get better in set pieces. This has been won of our biggest defensive laps. But with four cb the set pieces are much more effective. We managed against the germans who are one of the best if not the best team when it come to heading in goals.

Anonymous said...

agree with you pablo.d in the other hand disagree to what salvio supporter said .messi is the number but is not used as it has to be .as long maradona will be de coach that woun't change .i would try him like a winger ,tevz and higuain up jonas r.b but we nowadays play without midfield

GK said...

Jonas as a right back isn't a bad idea. He is great defensively and would add to the attack from the back line and at the same time open up a spot in our midfield for another player.... Pastore maybe?

Anonymous said...


theres your side then take out cambi drop pastore in middle

messi wide bring on aguero

its all so easy

Abs said...

- I wasn't happy with Samuel.

- Veron played his hear out as usual, but was that enough ?

- We need a play maker, even if we have to take Messi out for that !

- A RB could be a must in a faster game, but even though, was Otemndi good ?

- Tevez should get more playing time.

- Jonas and Di Maria, just keep playing like this and we should be safe.

Anonymous said...

that's unsane to talk about messi in the bench here's my team romero,micho,samuel,ansaldi,jonas,mascherano,banega,di maria,banega,messi tevez ,higuain

nj said...


some goalie

Anonymous said...

Can someone please explain why maradonna does not choose to play cambiasso?! And veron plays with heart but argentina need a player like riquelme, pastore looks promising but to young. Maybe aimar or benega. Also messi is worlds best player at barcelona, but is useless in maradonnas argentina, without a playmaker he doesn't get fed the plays he needs.


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