Well...Diego MARADONA has called up Martín PALERMO and he will be included in the squad for Saturday to face Brazil.
Together with him, Rolando SCHIAVI (of Newell's and loaned to Estudiantes when they won the Copa Libertadores) and Rodrigo BRAÑA (Estudiantes) are called up too.
BRAÑA? A really hard-working midfielder who never gets tired. A hound dog, if you like. The type of player you would want on your team when the going gets tough.
SCHIAVI has experience playing in Brazil too. He was at Gremio for some time and he lost that Copa Libertadores 2007 final against Boca and against PALERMO.
Martín PALERMO scored on Sunday to give Boca the win against Lanús and he reached 207 goals in his career with the blue and gold. He is only 11 goals away from becoming the all-time scoring leader of Boca Juniors.
Do I expect any of these three players to start against Brazil?
No. SCHIAVI may have a bigger chance, with all the injury problems we've got at the back, but I'd think he would start on the bench. So will PALERMO and BRAÑA.
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How can a call up for Palermo be defended? How? What the F.?
Awesome, call up a 35 year old Palermo and leave out Higuain. Even though he will not play how can you justify us this Seba? Don't get me wrong, Palermo is a hero and a legend for Boca but I believed his time was done after he missed 3PK's in a game. I guess I will just shrug my shoulders and say oh well.
Jack!
I know Seba mentioned that Palermo and the rest will probably just be on the bench, but seriously, this is just bad. I see no point whatsoever in calling them(specifically Palermo). Palermo only has a handful of matches with the National Team(so it's not for experience). He failed in Europe(again, not for experience). The only reason I can see why Diego has called him up is because he's played against several Brazilian clubs in his career. But even that is a ridiculous reason.
Here is some good news though. One our best young prospects does not go out to Europe but instead stays in South America and joins Corinthians and his name is MATIAS De Federico, well all know him well.
Jack!
Paulina and Jack...explain to me or show me where did I defend PALERMO's inclusion in our national team.
Does the headline say something? 'MARADONA goes LOCO'???? as in 'MARADONA goes crazy'...
I just stated some facts to provide some recent information on PALERMO. That doesn't mean I defended his call-up.
He gets called because it's Boca. Simple as that. But please don't say I'm defending his call up because I'm not.
And Jack...what DEFEDERICO did to Huracán is not something to be excited about. He said he was staying. He said he loved the club and then he back-stabbed them. They loved him there and now they call him a traitor and I don't think Huracán fans are wrong there.
Going to Brazil or to Europe is just the same in the eyes of the average Argentine fan.
So...no...I'm not happy about that and going to Brazil is not necessarily a step forward or a huge improvement, like going to Europe is.
I asked you to justify it I didn't say you were defending his call up. And yes I know the only reason he does get a call up is because is Boca. Love Palermo as the Boca player but I am a rationalist.
Ok De Federico is leaving to Brasil instead of Europe and you consider that the same thing? Didn't a certain Carlos Tevez and a certain Javier Mascherano do the same thing? That is right, they did and how did they turn out? Not saying that he will be the same player but it is not a bad move.
If he is a traitor then so is every player that says they love their club and leaves. It is a business. It is not like he is ultra wealthy like how Figo left Barca to Real Madrid or Laudrup who did the same.
When I was insinuating that he was going to Brasil instead of Europe, I did not mean that the Brasilian league is better then ours, no. I am happy he is still in South America and will get playing time. Could he have staid with Huracán sure, but the pay day for him and his family maybe in Brasil was much better. It is a crisis in the league right now with money.
Jack!
finally martin palermo? WTF...
I'm hearing Diego called up these three guys as insurance because Diego MILITO came from Italy with a knock in one of his knees. Nicolás OTAMENDI has a minor injury and Juan Sebastián VERÓN and Sebastián BATTAGLIA are both not 100% fit.
Jack...we never see eye to eye and we always disagree. I'm cool with that. But why should I justify the PALERMO call-up or any other call up?
Especially one I don't agree with...
Regarding DEFEDERICO, he is in a different position than other players who emigrate despite confessing their love for their selling club. DEFEDERICO forced his way out of Huracán and he turned their fans against him by saying one thing one day and acting a very different way the next.
TEVEZ and MASCHERANO never did that.
I'm not saying he won't get to go to Europe and I'm not saying he won't be a world class player in the future, all I'm telling you is that as far as the average Argentine football fan is concerned, leaving your country to play in Spain, England, Brazil or Burkina Faso is just about the same.
The majority of fans don't follow other leagues than the Argentine and they don't care about the players who used to play for their clubs once they are gone.
That's a fact.
This just in... Diego hinted that he himself will play alongside Messi in midfield.
He also called up another three extra players this morning. Valdano and Caniggia will be playing up front and Sergio Goycochea will be in goal.
Damn, he never stops surprising us...
Seba we agree to disagree it is simple as that. Basile was a Boca man himself and never once did he call up Palermo. So like I said in the past Maradona's brain does not function like a average mans. I understand Palermo has been a scoring machine in his day and has ate Brasilian defenders for lunch in his Boca days. He scores goals left and right but Boca is the system that works for him, not playing with Messi and Kun. I will not be shocked at all if he plays and wont be shocked if he scores. But this will be fools gold. If Maradona does not play the hottest goal scorer in the world right now in Licha along with Messi and Kun then I don't know. I given up on Higuain playing and Licha has made a fan over me. The Olympic Lyon fans have already forgotten Benzama.
I agree with you with the part that majority of people do not watch other leagues. I agree, do you think somebody from Mallorca watches our league? Personally, I watch as many games as I have time for. If a Barca game is going on at the same time as a Boca, I will watch Boca. But I will keep taps on Messi to see how he did in that game. For me it is a thin line between club and national. I have seen Boca win the ultimate prize in South American football. I have even seen them win a World Club Cup. Now I want to see my national team win a World Cup. But as long as our coach is messing up things then I just dont know. I expect a win on Saturday. As I said for all of us Argentines, the 5th of September will be a day to remember(Ok I stole that from V for Vendetta, I just replaced September with November).
Jack!
* Intercontinental Cup.
Jack!
Why do ARgentina keep calling old players its like they're lacking talent or something? shit they're the deepest team in the world and yet Veron, Zanetti, Schiavi, Palermo are on the roster!
Why is Maradona calling someone he knows won't play at all? This is way worse than Basile odd rituals. I mean, is he waiting for Palermo to give the team good vibes from the bench?
He may have good reasons not to call-up Higuain, but those reasons can't be good enough to justify, instead, a Palermo call-up.
By the way, the other day, after a Primera match, one of the commentators was talking about "Maradona leaving Argentina to Mohammed (Colón's coach I think) once they qualify for the WC". I haven't heard a word about this again, too bad I couldn't pay much attention. Did I miss any rumour?
The Titan !! Good luck to Palermo and the NT against Brazil. Yes, a loony move by Diego and I doubt Palermo sees any action. Despite being a big Boca supporter, Diego's continued allegiance to things Boca is disturbing (of course Boca fans would say that doesn't include Riquelme). In fact, despite Diego's comments that Riquelme is not on his mind these days, I beg to differ. Don't think it hasn't occurred to Diego that Martin and Roman are not friendly, and Palermo's call-up can be seen as a poke at Riquelme.
This "my gang" mentality of Diego's is the most disturbing thing about his stewardship of the NT. Before long all of Diego's call ups will have to get together, cut themselves on the fingers and share blood like a bunch of 12 year olds. And then not long afterwards, maybe we will see the Boca barrabrava in the stands for NT matches.
I state my opinion today that if we don't come out of these two matches against Brazil and Paraguay with a minimum of 4 points then consideration should be given to booting Diego. Enough craziness is enough.
One more thing, Seba is dead on about the local fans here in Buenos Aires not giving a s**t about players once they leave Argentina. It has amazed me, but so true. For the diehard fans I know, everything is about their club and the local league. For the large majority of them, once a player leaves for another country, be it in Europe, or to Brazil, Mexico, Chile , or whereever, they almost cease to exist.
Seba -
I didn't mean you defended the call up -- sorry -- I just meant in general - "how can such a thing be defended".
But I'm really worried about this game for Arg. Almost more worried than our game against Colombia!
Awesome post by Johnny -- quite interesting.
Looking forward to the podcast...there will be one before Saturday, right?
Paulina, yes there will be a podcast released before Saturday's game(along with a preview for the game).
People...these call-ups were emergency call-ups. There was no time to call someone from Europe to be 'on call' in case the players I've mentioned don't make it (MILITO, BATTAGLIA, VERÓN, OTAMENDI and also BURDISSO -who I didn't mention but has some physical problems-).
I still don't agree with MARADONA calling up PALERMO but in this situation, things change a little bit.
There isn't another proven goal-scorer, big target man, great header, not-afraid-to-play-big-matches number 9 in the local league besides PALERMO.
SAND's gone. FUERTES is not better than PALERMO and they are about the same age. BERGESSIO's gone to France -and he's more an enforcer rather than a natural goal-scorer-. SILVERA? NIETO? RAMIREZ? Nah...
Again, I don't think PALERMO will take a part on Saturday, but his inclusion is just an emergency (or at least that's the official word coming out of MARADONA's mouth).
I say BS to the "last minute" excuse.
The problem is that Maradona shouldn't really be dealing with "emergencies" - he has enough options to call in a great first team and great backups. Higauin is perfectly fine, as far as I know, and he should have been called up a long time ago. All these last second ramblings should never have happened.
The AFA seems fundamentally disorganized if they are having to do so many last second changes before probably the most important game of the qualifiers. Injuries are a part of every game. They should never really be thought of as a surprise or even a handicap. That's why you choose the strongest team possible at the outset.
And it just bothers me that we are saying that the Palermo issue is not that bad because he's not going to actually play. He'll just be on the bench. The bench is pretty damn important during these big games....
Seba -- again -- please don't take these comments as attacks on you personally! I try to write as quickly as I can because i"m at work, and they might come off more harshly than I mean them to...
Finally home after a loooong summer vacation. Part of the the squad is terrible; to include Palermo, Brana, Dominguez and Coloccini shows a lack of respect towards players like Garay, Samuel, Gonzalo, Zarate, Higuain, Cavenaghi and even Crespo. It's a disgrace. I still have a feeling we will not qualify for this WC. I love Diego for all he has done, he will always be my biggest hero in football....but he is not a coach. It is not smart by AFA to give this job to a crazy man.
Yeah, I forgot Schiavi. Incredible! The guy is 36 and very much over the hill.
Sebastian you seem to either love playing devils advocate who just likes to stimulate debate or are a Maradona fanatic who defends the indefensible.
Argentina have not qualified for the World Cup and are in danger of losing out because the AFA appointed a clown. None of Maradona's decisions make football sense. He is running a National team not a street gang. You continue to find justification for Maradona's daft decisions. His reign has been nothing but a soap opera. I doubt if even the writers of WCW could invent this drama.
Argentina are drawn against Brasil and Paraguay who are 2 very good teams. The least you would expect is a line up that will do itself justice. Instead you have a coach who is so full of resentment that he goes to extremes to exclude world class players in favour of his friends. The time has come to bite the bullet Maradona has to go. Its either Argentina ditch him and win the WC or persist with him and risk further humiliation.
After the humiliation in La Paz you would have expected a complete overhaul of this reality show. Instead there is just more arrogance and daft decisions. The exclusion of Riquelme, Hinguain, Zarate, Samuel, Cambiasso, Garay and Gonzalo for obscure local players. How do you justify the exclusion of these players in favour of players like Veron who is old, slow and has been past his sell by date over 6 years. Where is the logic in selecting Colocinni who Newcastle have been able to dispose of due to a lack of interest. Jonas is a championship player who is an automatic selection. How can players who failed to save their club from relegation be expected cope with the best in the world.
All this would be bearable if the right players were not excluded on the whim of this 4th rate coach. However the selection of superflop Palermo just makes all this appear to be a tragic comedy. He played for the National team in 1999 and flopped. He also flopped in Spain. He is nothing but a local folk hero.
Argentina may beat Brasil but with these antics run the risk of further humiliation.
To the last poster, who didn't sign his comment, I would have love to reply. Instead, I won't. Because he is implying MARADONA excluded RIQUELME when it was pretty clear that the player quit.
Paulina: I don't take your comment as an offense to me. One thing I'd like to point out is that once a deadline is passed (I believe it is 15 or 10 days before the FIFA dates), the national team managers cannot call up more players from European clubs.
You may accept it or not, but those are the rules and if MILITO, BURDISSO, VERON, BATTAGLIA were all perfectly fit, Diego wouldn't have called the three players he called up last minute (just in case the aforementioned players can't make it).
To everyone here. I'm not a MARADONA advocate or an idiot who don't see we are in a bad position.
What I am is someone who will ALWAYS support the team and will ALWAYS try to be positive.
I supported BASILE, PEKERMAN before him, BIELSA before those two and so on...
Say what you like about me. I don't care. I just think I shouldn't be the one underlining the negative aspects and call for MARADONA's head to roll when he didn't even have two consecutive weeks to work with his team and he's been forced to put out fires that were created before (by drawing away to Perú, at home to Ecuador and losing away to Colombia -after leading 1-0- and Chile too).
Yes, Diego lost twice, but he lost them in places were we more often than not come empty-handed from.
I'm sorry for all HIGUAIN-lovers. I could say the same about you (defending a player who continuously flirts with the chance of playing for France), but I don't.
I wonder what will happen with a lot of writers on this comments' box if Argentina win on Saturday.
I know a lot of you will tell me: "I told you we would lose. MARADONA is rubbish" or stuff like that, but I rather be in a position where I can fully and very happily celebrate our goals instead of being undecided between a win for Argentina or the chance to prove a point.
Thank goodness I don't have that dilemma.
Rune, welcome back. One thing about SCHIAVI. Old or not, he just won the Copa Libertadores with Estudiantes and he was instrumental in both final matches against Cruzeiro. Didn't look out of pace.
Yes...he didn't have to face ROBINHO and KAKÁ and that's another matter, but I wouldn't say he is very much over the hill because he can make up for his lack of youth (so to speak) with his tremendous experience.
As much s you guys are mad with the local call-ups im actually pissed that Heinze, Coloccini, Burdisso are on this team! lool its funny i just hope Dominguez-Pareja start at CBs
Seba - it would be foolish to make some wholesale decision from a result of the Brazil game.
If Argentina win, would you really say that it will be down to what Maradona did as coach? We are talking about a group of some of the best players in the world here. They SHOULD win most of their games. They will be at home. They have much more motivation to win. Why on earth would that result signify that Maradona won the game for Agentina? That's just ridiculous. It's not about the result -- it's about how they play the game. That's the only judgement that should be made.
Most people are just angry because Maradona seems to be putting Arg. at a disadvantage, in every step he makes.
I personally have no liking for Higuain. He plays for the team that I hate, and I've always found his flirtations with France obnoxious and calculating. But -- really -- who cares? If Higuain is one of the best prospects for scoring goals, then he needs to be there. These people are professionals -- who cares if they don't like each other in real life? WHo cares if he took sides against Heinze in the Real Madrid locker, or if his agent uses the Frnech card for salary negotiations? He's not THAT miserable a human being that he can't be part of the team.
You can say what you want about Riquelme -- that he quit , which is true-- but it would be unbelievably naive to believe that Riquelme's departure from the team had nothing to do with Maradona. Maradona wanted him out. He wouldn't have gone to the press if he wanted to keep Riquelme with the NT. Please. We all know how difficult Riquelme is -- we all know how he needs to be treated. Maradona knew exactly what he was doing.
I take issue with your comments about the result of the next game. I know this is a result-orientated business. But good football is fundamentally about GOOD FOOTBALL. Not about whether or not some fluke goal creates a fluke win for an undeserving team. What if Arg win 1-0 this way? All of a sudden we are supposed to lock lips with Maradona? Please!
Argentina -- has the best, most creative and gifted players in the world. They shouldn't be squeaking by and mired in petty jealousies and ludicrious excuses - they should be Barcelona. They have that capacity. I don't understand why you aren't upset that they haven't reached that potential - or that they are even showing glimpses of it.
Potential line up
Andujar
Zanetti---Samuel---Gonzalo---Papa
--------Masche---Cuchu-----------
Messi--------Riquelme------Datola
---------------Licha-------------
bench:
Garay
Milito
Higuain
Aguero
Zabaleta
Veron
Mara's line up
Andujar
Zanetti---Burdisso---Otamendi---Heinze
Maxi---Masche---Gago----Datola
-----------Messi--------------
------------Aguero------------
Bench:
Milito
Veron
Bollati
Licha
Shiavi
Palermo
etc...
how difference?
No. No. No. No. And no, Paulina.
I don't mean all the critics should change their mind and love MARADONA if we beat Brazil (be it 1-0 or 74-0).
I meant that some people are hitting MARADONA so hard that I wonder whether they would really feel comfortable if his team beat Brazil.
Also...if he takes all the criticism when he loses in Bolivia, why wouldn't he take the credit if the team beats Brazil?
Plus...I said it 100000 times before here on Mundo Albiceleste. And I say it again: MARADONA didn't have enough time to work with his players. That's a fact.
BASILE had all his players for more than a month (more than 30 days straight) for the Copa America and he had them producing some great stuff until we collapsed in the final and then he lost his dressing room.
All the previous managers had their time to work with the players.
Diego gets them 6 or 7 days before each WCQ double-header and he can only make what...two-four training sessions with them before he sends them to the pitch.
Believe me...I would be saying this about ANY national team manager because it would be unwise to ignore these facts.
How can you expect Argentina to play like Barcelona? Barcelona is a perfect machine. A machine made perfect by training EVERY DAY, EVERY WEEK, EVERY MONTH. It takes time for a team to be as solid as Barcelona.
Why didn't Real Madrid produced the goods when they had the Galácticos? Also...will they do it now? They have the players and back then...they even had the time and they failed.
Regarding HIGUAIN and our forwards...Paulina, you can't deny that all the forwards Diego has called up are firing in all cylinders. They are scoring at will. It's not like Diego is calling up guys who can't find the back of the net.
Get over it and move on. Diego doesn't like HIGUAIN just like many managers before him didn't like other star players.
And enough with this RIQUELME non-sense. Did MARADONA have anything to do when RIQUELME quit for the first time (under BASILE)?
Finally...on your point about GOOD FOOTBALL.
There's a maxim in football that says: 'Los clásicos no se juegan. Los clásicos se ganan' ('Derby matches aren't supposed to be played. They are supposed to be won').
Just like in 1990 in the World Cup, when we played horribly and yet we won it.
Don't expect to see the beautiful football you want to see.
I'm all for attractive football and free flowing passing game, but on Saturday I want to win. I don't care about beauty. I want to win so we can have more time to work and eventually be a side that plays beautifully.
If you expect to see beautiful football from any of the teams on Saturday (by the way...I have NEVER seen Brazil play beautifully under DUNGA), you have another thing coming.
Seba you said "Just like in 1990 in the World Cup, when we played horribly and yet we won it." you meant Almost won it. That wasn't beautiful football but sheer luck.
The last team that won a major tournament by such luck land horrible football is Greece in 2004.
If you realize Spain and Barcelona in Euro 2008 and Champs League, you would notice the beautiful football they played without conceding in their crucial games.
As of now, our defence is leaking goals same as the weak teams in Europe and the fact that Samuel was AGAIN overlooked (he's not injured) and have Burdisso and Collocini chosen ahead of him is really tragic!
Maradona's selection are inviting our opponents to thrash us and I haven't seen Argentina play Argentinian football since the Semi Finals of the 2007 Copa America
Messidona19, when Seba said "in 1990 we won it", I'm pretty sure he meant the match against Brazil(where we didn't play that well but still edged out the victory).
to Paulina I LOVE YOU FOR THAT. This is exactly my thoughts (Argentina -- has the best, most creative and gifted players in the world. They shouldn't be squeaking by and mired in petty jealousies and ludicrious excuses - they should be Barcelona. They have that capacity. I don't understand why you aren't upset that they haven't reached that potential - or that they are even showing glimpses of it.)
TO SEBASTIAN
What about Brazil in 1998 or 2002? What about Spain 2008?
why not to call back ayala the warriors instead of schiavi
Thanks Roy, I meant the match against Brazil and not the tournament when I said: "we won it".
Totti...what about Brazil in 1998 and 2002?
I don't understand your question.
I don't think you can compare Brazil 1998 and 2002 with Spain 2008.
Plus...Brazil didn't win anything in 1998. Did you mean 1994?
In any case, I wasn't impressed by their play in either the 1994 and 2002 WC-winning campaign. They were far from playing beautiful football. In fact, they were very criticized in their home country for the way they played.
Spain 2008? Beautiful to watch. Almost ideal. We'll see if they can repeat that in a World Cup rather than a Euro.
Plus...Spain DID have time to gel and many of their players are used to play together for club and country.
But again...maybe I don't understand your question.
As for the anonymous calling AYALA back...well...AYALA retired from international football. We do miss him, but calling for him is pointless right now.
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